Real Dumb Wi-Fi Question

brent

I've always been a cord-in-the-wall guy so I have no frame of reference or direct knowledge of this, forgive me.
My partner on the other hand is happy with wi-fi as you know modems give you both.
The Problem:
Everyday it takes her approx. 20-30 wasted minutes to connect to wi-fi. Multiple reboots of both devices. Interruptions to my workflow too. The modem is approx. 20 feet away in another room, separated by drywall and a little distance.
QUESTION:
does a modem furnishing wi-fi need to be in direct "sight" of the target computer? Or near it? I thought this was bounce-off-the-wall magic hoodoo. Seriously.
(If it needs to be closer then phone line is just $10USD and I'll handle it later.)
Thanks all.

tomscharbach

brent does a modem furnishing wi-fi need to be in direct "sight" of the target computer? Or near it? I thought this was bounce-off-the-wall magic hoodoo. Seriously.

No. Wifi is a radio signal that goes through walls and other "barriers".

The short answer is that something is wrong with your setup. Wifi adapters normally connect to the router without issues, several rooms away from the router. So something is wrong, and we need to figure out what.

What kind of wifi setup do you have? What adapter? How is the adapter connected to your computer? How far is the adapter from the wifi router? Is your router supplied by your ISP? If not, what router are you using?

A simple test: Assuming that your partner is using a laptop, have your partner boot up right next to your computer, and see what happens. If there are no problems connecting, then we know that it is your equipment.

Until we have some information, guessing is useless, but what you are describing sounds a lot like conflicting protocols, perhaps related to incorrect drivers for your adapter.

brent

tomscharbach thanks for the great reply, I will try to check the adapters. she does boot up next to me. I'm in the wall so of course I have connection immediately. She has troubles. We just moved to its one of those new century link Conehead modems. she just has a T44 thinkpad with Windows 10. W10 is up to date on drivers. No conflicts in her Device Manager. Will play with this some more.
She didn't have these problems at our old place. The modem was closer to her so I thought that was why.

WetGeek

brent The modem was closer to her so I thought that was why.

This probably has nothing to do with your problem, but you keep referring to your modem. A modem is a device that connects to a telephone line, and modulates and demodulates the sounds it hears to and from digital signals that the computer can understand.

I'm not being critical, or making fun of you. I just thought you might want to know that modems went out of style decades ago. Tom's reference to a router, is what you're actually referring to. Wishing your luck solving your partner's connection issue!

tomscharbach

brent Because the problem is occurring on a Windows computer, consider having your partner install Wifi Analizer (Matt Hafner) from the Microsoft Store. It is free and will give you a handle on signal strength and interference.

Axios

Normal loss interior walls usually 3-4DB per wall and some freespace but 20ft not much.
interference prob more likely if you live in a neighbor hood.

brent

tomscharbach WetGeek Century Link refers to this device as my "modem." The CL tech referred to this as my "modem", ergo so do I. Laugh away, I am low hanging fruit for sure.😉

stalebrim However, the strength of the signal can be affected by the distance between the router and the target computer, as well as the presence of obstacles such as walls or furniture. If the router is located too far away or there are too many obstacles between the router and the target computer, the signal may become weak and cause intermittent connections or slow speeds.

Opinions here on if this could be the case vary here, but that is what I originally believe(d). I want to try buying longer phone cord and move the router near us.

tomscharbach Because the problem is occurring on a Windows computer, consider having your partner install Wifi Analizer (Matt Hafner) from the Microsoft Store. It is free and will give you a handle on signal strength and interference.

I could try this, but how would I interpret the data? (sesame street tutorial please🙂!)

Axios interference prob more likely if you live in a neighbor hood.

What factors may cause that to happen? That's an interesting thing to say and an impedance of some sort sounds likely.

Thank you all for helping me dial this in. WIll try the move-the-modem-next-to-mama strategy tomorrow.

tomscharbach

WetGeek I'm not being critical, or making fun of you. I just thought you might want to know that modems went out of style decades ago.

I don't want to make fun of you, either, but DSL modem/routers are often referred to as modems, as in "DSL modem". Many ISP's use DSL in apartment buildings, connecting via phone lines rather than cable or fiber optic.

WetGeek

tomscharbach Many ISP's use DSL in apartment buildings

Thanks for updating me. It's been a long time since I've lived in an apartment, and I appreciate the correction!

Could it possibly be a telephone modem that's providing wi-fi in this case?

brent

tomscharbach WetGeek I'm not being critical, or making fun of you. I just thought you might want to know that modems went out of style decades ago.

I don't want to make fun of you, either, but DSL modem/routers are often referred to as modems, as in "DSL modem". Many ISP's use DSL in apartment buildings, connecting via phone lines rather than cable or fiber optic.

That old boy took a big ladder and began my line at the telephone pole, then across the roof, one bolt thru the mortar, and poof, a dsl jack. I was astounded at the efficiency.
(I'm assuming DSL).

edit: just to be clear, he installed a phone jack that phone cord goes into. the phone cord goes into the modem. the dsl wire comes out of the modem and goes to the computer. (but you knew all this)

Axios

Anything from -30dbm to-70dbm should be good -80dbm and higher no good.

tomscharbach

WetGeek Could it possibly be a telephone modem that's providing wi-fi in this case?

The ISP is CenturyLink, according to Brent, so no. Either DSL, cable or fiber.

stalebrim

Wireless routers do not need to be in direct sight of the target computer in order to establish a connection. In fact, they are designed to transmit signals through walls and other obstacles, allowing you to connect to the internet from any location within range of the router.

However, the strength of the signal can be affected by the distance between the router and the target computer, as well as the presence of obstacles such as walls or furniture. If the router is located too far away or there are too many obstacles between the router and the target computer, the signal may become weak and cause intermittent connections or slow speeds.

In such cases, it may be helpful to move the router closer to the target computer or to use a range extender or network repeater to boost the signal and improve the connection.

tomscharbach

brent I could try this, but how would I interpret the data?

Not much to analyze. The tool picks up all the wifi signals in your area, and shows them in graphical form:

Find your network and you can read the signal strength (dBm) off the chart. What you really want is signal above -50. If the signal strength is above -70, signal strength is adequate. Below -80, signal strength, won't connect reliably. Between -80 and -70, marginal.

You can click between bottom tabs for various views.

The bottom line (1 2 3 etc) show channels. 2.4 GHz channels most used are 1, 6 and 11 (see the chart). If you are on Channel 1, and it is crowded, switch to a channel that is less crowded. That will reduce signal interference.

Another quick thought: Most modern Windows computers are dual channel -- 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz. Check to see if your partner is using 5 GHz. If she is, consider switching to 2.4 GHz by turning off 5 GHz. 5 GHz is faster but 2.4 GHz is less fragile.

brent What factors may cause that to happen? That's an interesting thing to say and an impedance of some sort sounds likely.

Wifi is a radio signal, transmitted both ways (modem to computer, computer to modem). If you are competing with a bunch of other users on a channel, signals can interfere with each other, causing errors. Other things (basically anything elecrtic that goes "whhhrrrrr") can also cause interference. Run your electric drill next to the router and I guarantee you that wifi will go bananas.

brent Opinions here on if this could be the case vary here, but that is what I originally believe(d). I want to try buying longer phone cord and move the router near us.

All sorts of things can reduce signal strength. We have an area in our apartment that is a "dead zone" because the signal can't plow through the refrigerator. Anything metal kills signal. Walls don't normally (my computers are 25-30 feet and two walls away from my router, for example and I still get excellent signal strength), but walls reduce signal strength. The trick is to move the laptop and/or the modem around and see what increases signal strength.

Do quick look at "wifi dead zone" on the internet and you'll quickly get a working understanding.

Bottom line: Try different things and see what works.

brent

tomscharbach Thank you so much for the tutorial, it's appreciated. I will try everything. One more question I hope. Can I switch channels in that dbf software. Can I also use that piece of software you are using to switch 2.4 and 5GB? or is that a Windows setting?
Thanks
@Axios if this continues when she is next to the cone then probably thinkpad problems? I am in a more congested place than I used to live and a fridge is in the way of that 20 ft and drywall...
ps Axios I had another great clear understanding of how this works with your great reply. Then you deleted it!

tomscharbach

brent Generally, Windows is good at picking between 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz or using both if both the router and computer's wifi adapter are dual-band. I would change those settings only as a last resort. You change broadcast (router) channels in the modem, you change adapter GHz settings (not easily) in Windows. If it comes to that, we can work on it.

However, what you want to do is get decent signal from the modem/router (assuming that is the issue) to the place where your partner normally uses the laptop.

The best way to test that is to (1) check your signal from the location where your partner normally uses the laptop, and see what the dBm reading is at that location, and (2) check your signal within a few few of the modem/router and see what the dBm reading is at that location. If the reading at (1) is low, but the reading at (2) is high, then move the modem/router around until that you get decent signal where your partner normally works.

If moving the computer around is a pain in the butt, I think that Wifi Analyzer is also available as an Android app that can be installed on a smartphone.

tomscharbach

brent I am in a more congested place than I used to live and a fridge is in the way of that 20 ft and drywall...

If refrigerator is on a line between the modem/router and your partner's laptop, you've identified the problem. Instant dead zone in the refrigerator's conical "shadow". Radio signals go through a lot of things, but refrigerators aren't one of them. Move the modem/router up/left/right so that signal doesn't go through (or more accurately, can't get through) the refrigerator.

Axios

brent I didnt see toms post didnt want duplicate stuff..lol (He is pretty much spot on how I would go about it.
If it continues I would look at modem settings but that is so broad any setting might be causing it.
(since the modem is new) Does wired always work?
I owned a two-way-radio shop/cell phones and everything in between for 25years..

brent

tomscharbach
m=modem, in bedroom, in corner. wall runs between f and m.
f=fridge, on other side of mentioned wall
x=her workstation near fridge but also near bedroom door...no lines are clean

I really want take you and axios' advice to see what the heavy interference is because I am in a higher density place, and from that I can strategize...but the $10, 50ft telephone cord experiment to relocate modem next to her seems the next logical step.

brent

Axios all good. we've been here two weeks. she struggles to connect and always wins eventually but seems like wasted time to get there. but for me wired always works.
you can give me shortwave advice soon! you both are beyond qualified.

tomscharbach

brent ... but the $10, 50ft telephone cord experiment to relocate modem next to her seems the next logical step ...

See if you can find a cable that is designed for DSL (e.g. something like this). It will cost more, but an ordinary cheap-ass telephone cord isn't likely to be good enough, particularly if you are talking about a long run like 50 feet. If you try to use an ordinary telephone cord, chances are you will be trading one problem for another.