Solus Plasma 1920x1028 DPI 150% Fractional Scaling

WetGeek

WetGeek Every development team uses shared libraries

What I should have also mentioned in this context, is that for a big application that's largely built with code from shared libraries, the application itself can be surprisingly small. Sometimes it's referred to as "glue," as it connects together chunks of existing code with a small amount of new code that's specific to the application.

So removing the "big" application (like KATE) might not make as much of a difference as you expected, with all or most of its dependencies left behind to support other applications.

tomscharbach

WetGeek In a sense, you are preaching to the choir. I understand code reuse and shared resources/libraries, and I understand why installing a K-pop app (e.g. Kwrite) in Budgie would necessarily bring along a host of dependencies not used for Gedit, and vis a versus. The fact that Plasma (KDE-based) and Budgie (Gnome-based) use different dependency sets is obvious, and probably the reason behind Solus's suggestion that Plasma and Budgie/Gnome/Mate desktops are not interchangeable.

I was attempting to address @brent's reported problems with K-pop apps by pointing out (somewhat indirectly though examples) that K-pop apps require installation of a large set of seemingly self-contained dependencies not present in Gnome-based desktops like Budgie. I had hoped that my comment would explain why installing K-pop apps on Budgie would of necessity entail installation of a large number of dependencies, and to suggest that conflicting dependency-sets might account for the problems he has experienced with installing and using K-pop apps ("I'm K-packagephobic. Stuff of nightmares. Long stories.") outside of a Plasma environment. The two might appear to compatible at a surface level, but they are not, and "mix and match" between KDE-based and Gnome-based apps is probably not a good idea, unless you intend to use Flatpaks.

I obviously failed in that attempt, given your responses, but let me assure you that I have no antipathy toward Solus Plasma. I wouldn't be testing it as carefully as I am, let alone contemplating using it going forward, if I did. On the other hand, I've used two dozen operating systems over the years, and I've not yet discovered one that is even close to perfect. Plasma might be an exception, but I doubt it.

WetGeek Obviously, KDE isn't the only team to do this, even through you're both making an example of appllications that begin with the letter "K."

Our focus on K-pop applications is a result of the fact that we both come at the issues from outside Plasma. If it were the other way around, I have no doubt that we would be commenting about Gnome-based apps.

WetGeek

tomscharbach In a sense, you are preaching to the choir.

Sorry, I didn't know the extent or yours or Brent's understanding of code development. I was trying to be helpful, and to confirm that you're taking a very sensible approach.

tomscharbach

WetGeek I didn't know the extent or yours or Brent's understanding of code development.

I don't know what @brent knows or doesn't, and I doubt that my experience holds a candle to yours, because my career was spent in enterprise level IT, mostly management, and I did not do much applications development.

I'm not sure that code development is particularly relevant though. Obviously Linux uses a complex set up dependencies, and the dependencies are central to Linux architecture. Dependencies have grown over the years, and Linux is now at a point where it is easy to fall into "dependency hell", a situation in which conflicting dependencies, often circular, bring the system down and are very difficult to resolve, if they can be resolved at all. Dependency hell is the driving force behind containerization best practices at the server level and the trend toward modular/container development development at the DE level. But although dependency hell might be at the root of issues when KDE-based apps are installed on Gnome-based DE's, and vis a versus, I suspect that the problem is more related to lack of understanding about the differences.

I don't think that most Solus users understand how different KDE-based Plasma is from Gnome-based Budgie/Gnome/MATE. Solus warns about the difference and incompatibility on the Help Center page where "switch and swap" between the Gnome-based DE's is discussed, but doesn't, it seems to me, go far enough, warning that installing Plasma-based K-pop apps on Gnome-based Budgie/Gnome/MATE is likely to be problematic, and vice a versus.

Linux users usually treat apps as if "an app is an app is an app", but while that is true for generic apps like Firefox, it isn't necessarily true for core apps like the K-pops and G-pop apps.

My guess is that unrecognized differences are at the core of @brent's issues with K-pop apps.

In other news, and to wrap this thread up, I've ordered a 256 GB PNY SATA III M.2 from Amazon, and expect to install Solus Plasma on my 7390 by mid-September, keeping my existing 500 GB Windows M.2 on the side in case I need to reverse the process.

brent

tomscharbach "Kate's dependencies are numerous (kate5-data, kio, ktexteditor-katepart, libc6, libgcc-s1, libkf5bookmarks5, libkf5completion5, libkf5configcore5, libkf5configgui5, libkf5configwidgets5, libkf5coreaddons5, libkf5crash5, libkf5dbusaddons5, libkf5guiaddons5, libkf5i18n5, libkf5iconthemes5, libkf5kiocore5, libkf5kiofilewidgets5, libkf5kiogui5, libkf5kiowidgets5, libkf5newstuff5, libkf5parts5, libkf5plasma5, libkf5service-bin, libkf5service5, libkf5syntaxhighlighting5, libkf5texteditor5, libkf5textwidgets5, libkf5wallet-bin, libkf5wallet5, libkf5widgetsaddons5, libkf5windowsystem5, libkf5xmlgui5, libkuserfeedbackcore1, libkuserfeedbackwidgets1, libqt5concurrent5, libqt5core5a, libqt5dbus5, libqt5gui5 or libqt5gui5-gles, libqt5sql5, libqt5widgets5, libqt5xml5, libstdc++6, plasma-framework, qml-module-org-kde-kquickcontrolsaddons, qml-module-qtquick-layouts, qml-module-qtquick2, sonnet-plugins, darcs, exuberant-ctags, git, khelpcenter, konsole-kpart, mercurial, subversion), and a number of the dependencies listed, in turn, have numerous other dependencies. So I can see, I think, what is behind your comment."

You emphatically got my half-serious/half-tongue-in-cheek diatribe, thank you.
If I want to use a couple Kpop Applications, there's probably no harm in all the luggage in my computer. But I still have to see it...
...meaning the time I had 2 kpop apps installed, my weekly solus budgie update were disconcerting. About 25 budgie updates with about 65 k-updates. When one is looking at their terminal during install it's quite alarming to see.

My bias is--and I have no problem appearing shallow here---totally visual. Not a fan of my updates being majority KDE when I'm on Budgie. Like I said, probably no harm at all but it just doesn't feel/look right.

So I don't run K-apps anymore. But I still snark🙂

tomscharbach

brent But I still snark🙂

Don't we all. 😆

WetGeek

brent Not a fan of my updates being majority KDE when I'm on Budgie.

Has it occurred to you that Solus wouldn't update those packages without a reason?

brent So I don't run K-apps anymore.

Since you're based on Budgie avoiding KDE apps is not a bad idea at all. For example, I've never found anything that KATE could do and Gedit couldn't do. Especially if storage space is at a premium, it doesn't make good sense to use any of it for redundant software.

On the other hand, if there's a foreign application that you prefer by far to a similar native one, and you have plenty of disk space, there's nothing wrong with installing that foreign app.

I installed the kshisen game (Shisen-sho) on all my Budgie devices and gnome-mahjongg on all my Plasma devices, for example, and never give it a second thought. In both cases either the native app didn't exist, or it was not nearly as good as the foreign one.

WetGeek

tomscharbach I've ordered a 256 GB PNY SATA III M.2 from Amazon

Wow. I thought you mentioned a small M.2 in an earlier message. I wish you the greatest happiness with your new installation.

Yeah, dependency hell gets worse and worse as time goes by. Microsoft's answer is DotNet. It makes me wonder how I could ever have written two textbooks on a Kaypro 4-84 with a transient program area of 59 kilobytes, two floppy drives, and a copy of WordStar. 😃

brent

WetGeek Has it occurred to you that Solus wouldn't update those packages without a reason?

not complaining about theu updates at all. just the nuclear quantity of you-know-what🙂

tomscharbach

WetGeek I thought you mentioned a small M.2 in an earlier message. I wish you the greatest happiness with your new installation.

I did. I usually buy 128 GB for Linux installations, 256 GB for Windows installations. 256 GB was the smallest currently available in the CS900 line (effing supply chain), but it was discounted and I got it for $25, which about what I normally pay for 128 GB. The extra space won't hurt anything because that computer is where I keep the railroad data, about 65 GB.

WetGeek Yeah, dependency hell gets worse and worse as time goes by. Microsoft's answer is DotNet. It makes me wonder how I could ever have written two textbooks on a Kaypro 4-84 with a transient program area of 59 kilobytes two floppy drives, and a copy of WordStar.

Well, as long as you can type faster than you can think, all is good no matter how antiquated the equipment. 😆

WetGeek

tomscharbach I got it for $25, which about what I normally pay for 128 GB

That's about what I normally pay for half the capacity as well. Good deal!

WetGeek

tomscharbach all is good no matter how antiquated the equipment.

😄 When I wrote those textbooks, the equipment was state-of-the-art.

WetGeek

tomscharbach it was discounted and I got it for $25,

I, too, spent $25 at Amazon for a computer accessory. For the past several weeks, I've been doubling up on various characters, and I couldn't tell whether it was my fingers or my keyboard that was causing the problem. So, I decided to try a new keyboard in order to settle the matter.

I've been very pleased with Artek keyboards in the past, but a while ago I diverged and bought a different brand that would connect via Bluetooth with three different devices. I've been using it to connect with my media machine across the living room, my laptop on a stand in front of my chair, and my smartphone for texting.

Arteck now offers a model that will do all that, and doesn't have some of the problems that my most recent keyboard had. I found its little round keys to be a bit offputting. And it had no "right Control" key - the key that VirtualBox uses as its default "Home" key. I needed to reach out to the laptop itself in order to change a VM to and from full-screen. And the Up and Down keys were half the size of the Left and Right keys.

The new Arteck keyboard has none of those drawbacks, but it adds one of its own. It's the length of a full-sized keyboard, complete with a numerc keypad. So, as it sits on my lap, I need to reach slightly to the left in order to type on it. I'm going to use it for a while and hope I can get used to it.

So far, this has been the longest bit of text I've typed with it, and not a single key bounce. Not one duplicated character that I've needed to stop and correct. And not one edit that I've needed to perform after I've saved a message.

I hope to get used to it by the time you get used to KDE Plasma.

Axios

You guys are deeep thinkers...lol

WetGeek

Axios You guys are deeep thinkers.

Well, the tag does say "off topic." We want to be sure not to discuss anything "on-topic" here.

tomscharbach

Axios You guys are deeep thinkers...lol

Yeah, like moles with power shovels, we can dig ourselves into a hole faster than a speeding locomotive! Or something like that ...

tomscharbach

WetGeek Arteck now offers a model that will do all that, and doesn't have some of the problems that my most recent keyboard had. I found its little round keys to be a bit offputting. And it had no "right Control" key - the key that VirtualBox uses as its default "Home" key. I needed to reach out to the laptop itself in order to change a VM to and from full-screen. And the Up and Down keys were half the size of the Left and Right keys.

If you are having issues with your fingers, consider a mechanical keyboard -- stroke and feel are almost identical to the old IBM Selectric typewriter keyboards. Several of my friends (also of a "certain age") found that mechanicals eliminated typing errors as their fingers got less limber.

My opinion is that Das Keyboard models are head and shoulders above the rest, but my Plugable keyboards work well and geezer friends using other manufacturers (e.g. Logitech) are satisfied, too.

If you prefer the compact size keyboard, as I do, a lot of mechanical gaming keyboards seem to be that size, and might be a good choice if you can stand the lightshow.

Keyboards are tough. I use Plugable 87-key mechanical keyboards across the board (two in use, one in the closet waiting patiently until I spill a cup of coffee or drool too much). I used to use (and prefer) Das Keyboard, but Das Keyboard no longer makes 87-key versions, so I started using Plugable about two years ago.

WetGeek

tomscharbach If you are having issues with your fingers, consider a mechanical keyboard

I have a couple of those that I tried hard to like, but just couldn't. And, as it turns out, this Arteck model has cured the duplicate characters completely. So, my fingers still work okay.

It's just going to take a while to form new "muscle memory" that's approiate for this model. Maybe before long Arteck will release an 87 key version with these same features, and I'll get one immediately.

alfisya

tomscharbach Kolus Klasma

😆 😆 😆

tomscharbach

I went ahead and installed Klasma on the 7390. Fractional scaling at 150% seems to be working fine.

The only issue I see is that the installation is using a lot of battery, more than I expected, but i'll use the laptop for a week or so under more normal conditions and see how it goes with the battery. In earlier testing using Solus Budgie, I got about 70% of W11 battery life, and I can live with that under Klasma.

Thanks to all who commented on the original post.

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