hdansin .. When I was in high school we had a foreign exchange student from Norway who spoke good enough English to participate in classes and socialize on his own in a tiny rural town in upstate NY.
that could describe any town from the Catskills to outside Buffalo. I've never seen a state in the usa with so many small towns. my old lady's family is in central NY and I go there a lot. So many hundreds on hundreds of towns there that are 'the sticks', measured by how many towns over the bigger stores were at..
hdansin But still, I feel that English speakers are oftentimes held to a lower standard when learning another language, simply because we don't have to learn another language in order to travel.
that is absolutely correct. I agree. we are spoiled by that lower threshold. as an anecdote, in Spanish I am content to simply understand and be understood. I (arrogantly?) do not feel the need to reach for a bigger vocabulary or micro-contextualize anything, after all, I'm home.
hdansin When I was in Beijing Mark Zuckerberg came there and did an interview where he spoke Chinese (he learned some for his wife I guess). His pronunciation was pretty terrible even to a non-native ear, but many Chinese people I knew were impressed because a white dude speaking intelligible Chinese is pretty unheard of, or at least it was.
there's these videos on YT I used to be addicted to. some dark-haired curly-headed portly white kid (reminded me of a calmer version of Jonah Hill) who spoke PERFECT Chinese and he'd go into Chinese restaurants (NYC?), then halfway thru the meal speak to the server in perfect Mandarin (or proper Chinese?). The Chinese eaters would double-triple-quadruple-take in disbelief. Many wanted to talk, many stayed in complete shock. Like all videos of this kind, the novelty wears off.
hdansin Anyway, anecdotes and stories are inaccurate data-wise, but they can lead us to the truth. I suppose I am being a bit reactionary given our current national climate.
Anecdotes and real-life experience have a realer kind of truth than raw data--agree 100%. On your second point, you are fine, and climate noted. Interesting times.
hdansin I hope to give my kids that opportunity with immersion programs if we can afford it.
the old lady, who is a heck of a lot more interesting than me, taught ESL in Korea way before I met her. Flew there knowing no Korean. She lived there for 6 years and left speaking perfect Korean. She's a big believer in immersion of course. When your life depends on it, you have to learn the language well.
All other cases, as you said, are less motivating 🙂.
I appreciate all you said, thank you. @Sebastian : great thread
